Chaos Dreadnoughts are very rarely taken in CSM armies...why?
1) The model is fucking awful, lol.
2) Crazed means your Dreadnought does something you can't control 33% of the time.
3) They don't really have much in the way of character to make up for points 1 + 2 even in 'Fluffy' armies.
What they need to be viable.
1) A decent model would be nice.
2) Crazed needs a total rethink, Fire Frenzy needs dumping.
3) Some way of making Dreadnoughts of a particular god a bit more characterful.
I like to think of Chaos Dreadnoughts being quite assault orientated therefore the 'default' configuration is going to be biased towards that, with options to make it shooty if that's your preference. I've also changed a few things like the Reaper Autocannon profile and how Dirge Casters work (these changes will end up being consistent across the board for all units so if you don't like them now is the time to complain).
Chaos Dreadnought - 105 Points.
Dreadnought WS 5, BS 4, S 6, F 12, S 12, R 10, I 4, A 2/4
Unit Type - Vehicle (Walker)
Wargear
Smoke Launchers, Searchlight, 2x Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon c/w Twin-Linked Bolter.
Special Rules
Crazed *, Bonded for an Eternity **
* Crazed - A millennia locked in the sarcophagus of a Dreadnought gradually eats away at the sanity of even the strongest mind - At the beginning of each turn roll a die for each Chaos Dreadnought, if the result is 2-6 the Dreadnought acts normally. Should the roll be a 1 however, the Dreadnought becomes subject to the 'Rage' and 'Fleet' special rules until the beginning of the next controlling players turn.
** Bonded for Eternity - The Dreadnought and pilot have endured an eternity of constant warfare and can shrug aside damage that would incapacitate a lesser construct - All 'Crew Stunned' results are reduced to 'Crew Shaken'.
Options
The Dreadnought can exchange either or both arms for any of the following options. It loses an attack for each Dreadnought close combat weapon exchanged and the attached Twin-Linked Bolter. If the Dreadnought is left with no Dreadnought close combat arms it obviously no longer gets the bonuses for them.
If two of the same options are taken then the 2nd selection uses the higher points cost.
- Reaper Autocannon - 15/25 points ***
- Twin-Linked Lascannon - 25/35 points
- Multi-Melta - 15/25 points
- Plasma Cannon - 25/35 points
- Missile Launcher - 10/10 points
*** Reaper Autocannon - Range 36", S7, AP 4, Heavy 3, Twin-Linked.
A Twin-Linked Bolter may upgraded to a Heavy Flamer for 5 points.
May be equipped with a Havoc Launcher for 10 points.
May take a Dirge Caster **** for 5 points
**** Dirge Caster - Emits a terrifying mix of Screams, Wails, Scrapcode and unholy prayers to the Chaos Powers - Any enemy unit within 6" suffers a leadership modifier of -1, Any friendly Unit within 6" becomes 'Stubborn'.
Marks
May take one of the following Marks.
- Mark of Slaanesh : +1 I, counts as being armed with Assault Grenades - 10 points.
- Mark of Khorne : Gains D3 Attacks for charging rather than the normal 1. In addition a Dreadnought with the Mark of Khorne fails its 'Crazed' roll on a 1 or 6 - 20 points.
- Mark of Nurgle : Counts as being armed with both Assault and Defensive Grenades - 15 points.
- Mark of Tzeentch : May select a single psychic power from those available to the Chaos Sorceror (obviously I haven't made these up yet, lol) and Counts as Ld. 10 for the purposes of taking psychic tests - 25 points
A Dreadnought that has taken the Mark of Slaanesh may take any of the following upgrades
The Dreadnought can exchange either or both arms for any of the following options
- Blastmaster - 15 points
May exchange any Twin-Linked Bolter for a Sonic Blaster for 5 points
May exchange any Twin-Linked Bolter for a Doom Siren for 10 points
A Dreadnought that has taken the Mark of Tzeentch may take any of the following upgrades
- Inferno Bolts for Twin-Linked Bolters - 5 points per Bolter
- Inferno Bolts for Heavy Bolters - 15 points per Heavy Bolter
This one took a lot of thought and therefore is probably most open to debate.
The debating floor is now open...
up the points by 10 or so
ReplyDeleteit comes with a 10 pt upgrade (the arm) and higher WS and has lost fire frenzy negative. and it ignores stunned and shaken but thats a nice touch
no missile launcher? not even with cyclone stats :(
the dirge caster is nice the reaper i dunno i like what you've done i just feel its a bit too much as its meant to be an ancient assault cannon esq gun, maybe drop the range down to 24"?
mark of khorne is crazy! 5 attacks basic +1 for 2ccw and up to 3 on a charge at strength 10 power weapon. for the same cost as assault and defensive grenades?
that just seems to be a no brainer choice.
@Mark - Apparently we think alike, lol.
ReplyDeleteI deleted the +1 attack for the Khorne Mark, modified the profile to indicate that the 4 attacks was including the Dreadnought close combat arms and modified the points for some things before I'd even checked for comments.
The Reaper Autocannon is staying as is though I may up it's points cost slightly.
So i can have two multi-melta, plasma cannons reapers etc..? twin multi melta dread 135 points...
ReplyDeletei like twin blastmaster dread!135 2 battle cannon blasts :D
ReplyDeleteChaos Dreadnoughts should be distinctive from the Marine type.
ReplyDeleteThis way you can have a decent assault unit as a default or a decent fire support unit if you upgrade.
The Blood Angels codex opened the way for better Dreadnought variants I've just adapted them in such a way that you don't need 4 different entries for them.
This way if you want to go Khorne you take an assault unit, Iron Warriors 'Siege' variants are viable as are Thousand Sons or Emperors Children or anything else you can think of.
Why not 2 Multi-Meltas for 135 points, you can stick them on a Landspeeder for 80 points and that can be in the face of any unit in the game on turn 2 with a 4+ Cover Save any-time it wants.
Just to clarify then, no-one's complaining about the concept...just the points cost?
@ Mark - Oh and the Blastmaster one would be 145 points. I think you forgot to pay the 10 points for the Mark of Slaanesh, lol.
ReplyDeleteconcept is tricky the only weapons dreads have for mortis style is autocannons, feasibly heavy bolters and missiles could be easily done. energy shots are tricky due to power drain, a twin-linked lascannons power supply is enough space for 3 space marines (on a landraider)
ReplyDeleteso concept is tricky for energy guns, points is defiantly low especially as you can always shoot BOTH due to dreadnought and ignore stunned shaken.
Iron Warriors would have Dreadnoughts with dual heavy weapons. World Eaters would have pure assault variants. The only balance issue I can see is points cost.
ReplyDeleteIf you look how the different Marine codices have been written they all have an individual character. The character of a Chaos Marine army should be that you can never really be sure what your going to be facing ;-)
Chaos should be the most customisable army there is and at the moment everybody just thinks of them as spiky Marines.
I can guarantee that when the Chaos Codex is redone that they'll be unique.
I'll tweak the points cost and rules slightly but the base concept will be unchanged.